Hello and welcome to Tina's Corner podcast. We are a group of like minded sign language interpreters set out to improve the field of sign language interpreting. We have deaf, hearing, and deaf blind consumers, as well as both Deaf and hearing interpreters. And the focus of this podcast is to strengthen the bond between those groups of individuals, all persons, regardless of years of experience will benefit. I am Tina Perry, and I welcome you. Today I have invited Lily Riley. Lily is going to share her insights and experiences so that others can see that interpreters travel different roads on their journey, only to arrive at the same destination...Equality of information for all consumers. Welcome, Lily.
Lily:Thank you, Tina. I'm so glad to be here.
Tina:Well, I am so glad you are here on a SAT beautiful Saturday here. I don't know what it's like back in Ohio. But here in Tennessee. It is beautiful.
Lily:Yeah, it's pretty gorgeous here today. And I'm grateful for it. We had frost three days ago. Yeah.
Tina:Well, you're gonna have snow and ice tomorrow. So(Lily)vExactly. Yeah. That's why I moved to Tennessee. (Lily) Smart Woman. Not very many people have said that to me. So I'm gonna take it.
Lily:Yes, indeed, smart woman.
Tina:Let me introduce you to our audience. Lily. Lily is a black interpreter or African American interpreter. She can go by both titles, and is a freelance interpreter as well. Now Lily says she graduated from Project Project Climb. And we'll talk a little bit about that. But she also graduated from Columbus State Community College. Am I correct?
Lily:No, I actually attended Mott Community College in Flint, Michigan.
Tina:Darn.I thought you graduated from my program.
Lily:I did not.
Tina:How did that happen?
Lily:I'm a Michigan girl.
Tina:Oh,no, no. Did I ask you to interview? Michigan? Okay, I apologize. I thought, yeah. Well, you know what, she's so good that's why I figured she was one of our students. But okay, Michigan will let you have this one. (Lily) Thank you so much. She did graduate from Project Climb, which is also the acronym for Cultivating Legal Interpreters from Minority backgrounds. Can you tell us a little bit about that program, please?
Lily:Sure. So I learned about Project Climb from my employer, they mentioned, you know, Hey, there's this program coming out of University of Northern Colorado. And maybe it's something that you would be interested in because I mentioned that I was interested in getting into some legal interpreting. I do have experience as a legal advocate for deaf and hard of hearing participants going through legal processes like obtaining protection orders and things like that, but I want to get in on the interpreting side. So what the University of Northern Colorado has done is started this project, Climb program which pairs, interpreters of minority backgrounds and this includes PLC interpreters, heritage interpreters, codas, all of those interpreters who may not necessarily have been exposed to an opportunity to get into the legal field. So we're paired with interpreters who have vast legal experience. And then they walk us through what a legal process is, how we understand that as interpreters and how to interpret that for our deaf consumers. So that is a nine month intensive program that was completed virtually and thankfully, I was a part of the inaugural class, we were able to convene before COVID and completed the nine months in the midst of COVID reaching its height. So we were not able to come back together for graduation ceremony, however, going through that process was absolutely yes, overwhelmingly invaluable as an interpreter of wanting to get into legal field because sometimes there are barriers to interpreters who are not white cisgendered female interpreters, you know, sometimes there may feel to be barriers or doors for us going into other fields. So this was extremely beneficial. And I met so many wonderful people learned so many wonderful skills. And definitely I encourage any of your listeners who are who fit into that minority interpretive background to check out Project Climb.
Tina:That sounds awesome. You know, isn't it funny how we are starting to use COVID as our time marker?
Lily:Exactly, exactly. It's like it's pre COVID. Yes, mid COVID. In this post COVID
Tina:We kind of just forgot about the time before COVID. And it's all based on when COVID came. And it just kind of like, it's that timeline. I hope eventually we'll get out of that, because I'm hoping that we just get out of COVID Completely.
Lily:I hope so, too. Yeah,
Tina:That project sounds absolutely awesome. And then you were featured in this viral internet called, "Don't Rush". And it was featuring local interpreters of color, it is awesome. And you know, what I'm going to do is I, if I can, if there's a link for that, that I can put it on here so that people can look at it. But tell me a little bit about that program. And I would just want you to know, Shawnice who is one of our graduates made that. Tell us A little bit about that?
Lily:Sure. So, um, you know, I have Instagram and Facebook and all that. So I had seen this Don't Rush challenge, and I had a few friends who participated. So basically, you know, people would the song would play and people would show themselves one way, and then they would kind of glitch and then they would be, you know, dressed up or, you know, dressed in their profession or you know, things like that. So, very cute little trend. And, you know, I loved watching the videos. And one night, Shawnese reached out and sent me a text she hey I'm thinking about doing one. She did the editing and you know, all of the everything, she put it all together. And the video actually went viral. We published it in April of 2020. And I remember when we published it, you know, each of us interpreter's posted it on our Facebook pages and our Instagram. And you know, I got a few messages. And some people like, Oh, this is so nice. I can't believe it. But the next morning I woke up. And um, one of the videos was already at 5000 views, and I completely lost my mind. I thought I was like, oh my god, this is amazing. It was amazing, absolute cutest thing ever. So I was so excited to be a part of
Tina:It was it was really amazing. I was so impressed. And that. I was like, wow, who did this? So now? Yeah, I know. I'm so glad that you were a part of that. That was awsome. You're absolutely welcome. You have also interpreted for a variety of people and settings, including social justice initiatives during the height of the Black Lives Matter movement. Yeah, 20 - 21. And as an interpreter, you worked in all
the settings possible:educational, medical, legal, social services, government, VRS VRI domestic violence for interventionist for a deaf agency and as a career counselor for the Deaf, and you mentioned that deaf and disabled people. Wow. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And yeah, good for you. That's quite the background. And, of course, we know, as interpreters, we rarely just stay in one area in it sounds like you have made that a proven fact.
Lily:Definitely, I'm really, I feel really blessed to be able to, you know, have experience in all those different arenas because, you know, sometimes you can kind of get into a rut. And, you know, if you get into a field of interpreting, like, Okay, this is my niche, I'm feeling really good here in education, but it does, you know, keep your skills up to par when you get into those other areas. And I am just, I really do feel blessed to have touched on all those different niches and interpreting,
Tina:And I'm sure all your consumers felt that blessing as well. Thank you. So tell me Okay, well, we already know the answer to this question, but I'm gonna ask you is when and where did you graduate?
Lily:So I went to Mott Community College in Flint, Michigan. I started there in 1997. And that was a couple of years after I've gotten out of high school. And I absolutely love that program. But I will say this at the time that I went through Mott's program, I was loving it. And I got married and my husband at the time moved to Columbus, he was offered a job here. So we came here to Columbus. And one of the things that I wish I would have experienced in my journey and a difference that I wish I would have made when I got to Columbus is I wish i would have just re-enrolled at Columbus State. Because I did complete all of my classes that Mott, but we were transferred out right before the end of my practicum for graduation. And so once I got to Columbus, and I'm like, oh, you know, I would love to have gone to Columbus State and like finish with everybody here. Because honestly, you can tell a Columbus State interpreter from other programs is just, I think it's you, Tina. It is something. It is something about, you know, the Columbus State Program and the way that it has evolved over time and things like that. That is definitely something that I wish I would have availed myself to in the beginning, but my time at Mott was definitely Wonderful. So I ended up moving to Columbus and in the year 2000. And I've been here ever since.
Tina:Well, thank you for the kudos for Columbus State on Mott State did a great job. And I you know what? I'm gonna I don't I didn't tell you I was going to ask you this. But when did you and I first meet?
Lily:You know, I was trying to remember that. And it has been so long. I honestly do not remember. I know that it was at Columbus State. And the same way I can't remember exactly when I met Royce. Yeah, I can't. You know, it's just funny. Yeah, it's crazy. I think we just all kind of floating together like, Oh, you're an interpreter. Okay. Well, now, you know.
Tina:I know you always came to watch the wonderful performances at Shadow Box for Royce Yeah, yeah. And myself. But yeah, I don't Yeah, I'm gonna have to think back. The problem for me as I've encountered so many students that I just my memory is just bad. Yeah as far as specifics, but I'm glad our paths have crossed, let's just leave it at that. So why interpreting what what caused you to want to become a sign language interpreter.
Lily:So I, I was born with a hearing loss myself, I have an 80% loss of my right ear 20% of my left ear. So I, in elementary school was supposed to learn sign language, just because it was never determined the cause of my hearing loss. And so it looks like, you know, I was put into a mainstream program, so that I could, you know, have one foot in the hearing one foot in the deaf, well, just in case, all of my hearing wet. So I kind of was exposed to sign language a little bit, graduated high school, I went to college initially to become a elementary school teacher, and went all the way through that program until the student teaching faze when I realized I don't like other people's children. Okay, so I need to do something to try to, like, you know, redeem my time here. What am I going to do? And, you know, my college was offering a sign language class and I said, Well, I'll just take that. And, you know, just basically pass some time. And but once I took the class, I said, you know, this, this feels like home, this feels like what I should be doing. So that's when I transferred to Mott, and just went through their program, then.
Tina:Nice. I'm gonna ask you the challenges for you as a black interpreter. But I'm going to take a step back a minute here. And I want to ask you, were there any challenges for you as a black student?
Lily:Yes. Wow. That's a good question.
Tina:I only ask good questions.
Lily:So I think honestly, that is where the student level of interpreting, like when you're in the program, is where you really began to encounter, you know, those difficulties and things like that there were times when I would be in class with the majority, white female colleagues. And, you know, for instance, I remember one time in particular, that we were going around the class giving answers to a homework assignment. And of course, the answers have to be in sign. And when it came to me, the person who was in front of me said, Oh, she probably doesn't know the answer. And they tried to skip me. Oh, and go to the girl next to me. And I just could not figure out like, why would you think I wouldn't know the answer? And at first, I was so stunned. I didn't say anything. And the girl after me after she went, put my hand up and said Why wouldn't I know the answer. And, you know, the teacher at the time, I think that she was caught off guard, too. You know, I don't know I you know, she didn't interject at all. And I said, you know, why wouldn't I know the answer? And everybody just kind of sat in silence. And I went ahead and gave the answer. For the question that was supposed to be mine, and for the rest of the questions on the homework assignment, I just didn't care at that point, because I said, you know, she skipped me. Now I'm gonna take up all the time now I'm gonna, you know, and but I always that just stuck in my head. You know, I think that, because in interpreting does have a white male face, that sometimes people kind of look at students who try to get into this field as, Oh, that's cute, this is what you want to try to do. But, you know, there's not really a place for you. And even if that's not expressly said, that is what is felt by a lot of minority interpreters. My most recent employer, I worked for Hallenross Associates, and we had initiated a program to reach out to minority and PLC students who we're reaching who were just starting an interpreting program, because wanted to catch them at that phase where they were getting those negative remarks in the classroom or being slighted or seen as less than or, you know, quote unquote, affirmative action students who would barely make it by the skin of their teeth. We want to reach out to them to let them know No, there's a community who supports you, and who believes in you, you have just as many skills as your white counterparts, and we're here to help you. So, you know, my experiences, as a black student really helped to propel my passion to reach out to, you know, the black students now in the program.
Tina:Okay, I have to ask you, because Lily, I know you. And you know, me, and you know, that we both are kind of, you know, like, don't let things kind of just roll off our back without maybe addressing them did address that student because I'm trying to figure out in my head. First of all, where did you get the Kahunas to do that? And second of all, what did you mean, did that ever come up as a discussion?
Lily:It did not. And the reason that it didn't come up as a discussion is because when I try to approach it during our break, like, why would you think that I wouldn't know? Then she cried. And so then everyone comforted her. And I was, you know, I was the bad student, then I hurt her feeling that made her cry. And so you know, it never really came to, you know, a resolution. So, yeah,
Tina:Well, okay. Well, I'm gonna move on. Yeah. So, now that you have brought, we did discuss, but I'm sure there, I'm guessing maybe there were other things that you experienced as a, as a student. Tell me now about being a black interpreter? What, What did you challenge? What What challenges did you encounter in that arena?
Lily:So I would have to say the first thing that pops into my mind when I think about challenges as a black interpreter is, um, you know, just sometimes consumers being shocked that I'm the one to interpret for them. And, you know, I did medical interpreting for a few years, I absolutely loved it. But, you know, it is difficult for some deaf consumers, particularly older, white, Deaf consumers to embrace a person of color, being the hands that they received the message from (inaudible) you know what I mean? So a lot of times just having to get over their shock and awe. Or them, I would sign something or interpret something, and I would get that, oh, you're good. I didn't, I didn't think you would know that. Oh, you know, and, or, you know, things that where they would question my credentials were, what agency are you with? Who sent you with the, you know, someone so, you know, it was always kind of, like, let me validate, make sure that you're actually a real person. And, you know, you're not, I guess, Deaf fishing, for lack of a better word. Um, but you know, so many things like that. But then also, when I think about interpreting in a teaming environment, there have been times when I am teamed with the white interpreter, and the consumer only pays attention when the white interpreter signed. Wow. And, you know, those things, that hurts, you know, I'm like, why do you all automatically assume that I'm not just as good as she is? Or he is? So you know, things like that? I'm not really being, you know, they hold their questions until the white interpreter sign in so that she can be the voice of, you know, questions and meanings and things like that. So I could go on and on, but that's just the tip of the iceberg.
Tina:Yeah, yeah, that sounds very challenging. That I, yeah, I can understand. I mean, I guess I can't understand because I've not been treated that way. So excuse that, that I said that, but I, that would be struggling, that would make me struggle, I think as an interpreter, and probably would cause you to be exhausted, you know, exhausted to have to go in and always to having to prove yourself.
Lily:Yes, yes, definitely. And I have to say, too, one of the things that I didn't touch on was the, you know, those feelings coming from my fellow interpreters as well. You know, one of my more recent assignments that I went on, when there was an interpreter paired with me, and I never met her before, she, you know, within the past few years, graduated from the program. And apparently, you know, she has, you know, done quite a few assignments, and she's really good with the agency that she worked for, but it was just our first time meeting. And, you know, in her mind, she was just like, Oh, I'm the experience when you're new here. So I'll take over. And I have learned to, you know, as I'm getting older, maybe as a, you know, maybe as God kind of helping me to be a little bit more graceful, a little less abrasive, but I just said, okay, you know, I kind of sat back and I did my job. However, when there was a time that, you know, she needed some assistance with voicing and things like that. You know, it's, it's in those moments where my skills prove themselves, and I don't have to address it, because now, you know, now you see the error of your ways, or I hope that you do, but yeah, you know, when it's coming from a colleague, that's difficult. Yeah.
Tina:What advice do you have for us as your white peers? How can we be allies in these racially tense teaming situations? And it sounds like what you described was very tense. I know that it sounds like you handled them nicely, but what what advice or what, what do you want to say?
Lily:You know, when it comes to white interpreters teaming with black interpreters, I will say just, you know, definitely go into it with the same mindset that you would give one of your white peers don't assume that we're less skilled, we're less abled, don't assume that if we need a feed, that that means that, you know, we're unprepared you know, feeding is what interpreters should do seamlessly that should be one of our skill sets, that should not be something that is used to demean each other. I feel also feel if you're teamed with a person of color in an environment and there is there is bias coming from the deaf consumer, it is a very valiant act of allyship, for the white interpreter, to be the one to you know, to, to notice that and maybe address it because what I have, what I truly believe is that bias discrimination, when it comes to that is racially racial bias and discrimination really, none of that changes until the people who are least affected by it become the most vocal. So at the end of the day, black people can be you know, we can march we can do all of that, but it is the white people who arm in arm on with us, who will be heard, the white people will be the ones to address the the wrong thinking or the insensitive comments, because a lot of times, especially as a black woman, there is the angry black woman trope. So, when I go to address something that is inappropriate than Oh, her tone is so harsh or you know, that kind of thing. And so, everything that we do has an additional color to it outside of our skin, we are you know, it has another color of hostility or aggression, that may not actually be there, but until and unless people who are least affected by discrimination become the most vocal then that is only when things will change. If I am in an interpreting situation with a white counterpart, and I am being overtly discriminated against, I expect for my white counterpart to acknowledge and address that like, if do you have a problem with the team here? Okay, well, if you send her away, I'll be going away too. Because we come as a team you don't get to keep one of us and that both of us. That is where allyship is demonstrating And that that is how we then turn any of the bad attitudes toward POC interpreters, and really start to make people uncomfortable in their own best. I don't want to be the only person uncomfortable in the situation. Let's make the perpetrators uncomfortable as well.
Tina:Wow, I can almost end there. Exactly. And I think that's what we, as white interpreters need to hear. You know, I think if we were to encounter something like that, it's an awkward situation. And what do we do with that? You know, and I think what you just said, answered that question perfectly. If we come as a team, we come together. And if one of us is being discriminated against, I'm just kind of recapping what you're saying, then we're both being discriminated against, in some sense, because you're not going to just allow I'm not as the white interpreter, I'm not going to allow that to happen to us together as a team. So that's great.
Lily:It was a difficult thing to do. You know, I, that puts you in a tough position. And you're at that moment, you know, advocating for me. And it's not it's not easy. It's not easy, but it's necessary.
Tina:It isn't easy. And yeah, yeah. But I think that was absolutely great advice. And I hope that those who are listening to this will take that to heart and be like, you know, even having these discussions are so critical. Yeah, you know, just so that we can have this open discussion, you know, you know, Royce is my best friend and I, and I shouldn't have said it like that, but she is Royce is my best friend. And you know, that everybody knows that she and I are and we've had open discussions. Yes. Sometimes, you know, both of us will look at each other and like, yeah, that's not really appropriate, or that is appropriate, and that those are the people that you need in your life, to be able to say to you, Hey, that's not appropriate. That's not how it is. And that's, and I think those are the friendships that we have. And I know Royce and I have that friendship. And you do know she's now Dr. Royce carpenter.
Lily:Yes, she is Dr. Royce Carpenter. Every time I think about that, I get the chills. Just oh my god, I'm so proud of Extremely hard, you know, our, the local black interpreter, we
Tina:I am so proud of her too. And so she you know, I always her. tease I said, you know, Royce, Dr. Royce Carpenter, I'll call you that one. She said, I have to do it for a minimum of six or kind of consider her our fairy godmother. So there is there's maximum of six months, after six months. I said, you're always be Royce to me. But Dr. Royce Carpenter, and that is awesome that's why I'm so happy for her. She worked so hard for that. nothing that Royce can do that we won't love. So yeah, no. Yeah, she, yeah, we all love Royce. Everybody does. So tell me after you graduated, where? Where did you go? Now we want to kind of talk to those who are just about to graduate or those who've been in the field. Well, how did you find out about your first jobs? Like, what did you do to get yourself out there to be employable?
Lily:So when I moved to Columbus, and I decided, hey, you know what, I'm gonna give this a shot. I have this education. And let me just see what I can do. I'm dating myself here, but I went to the Yellow Pages.
Tina:What are those? And could you expand on that? (laughter)
Lily:I pulled up at handy dandy phonebook. And I looked up and the interpreting agency, and I had the audacity to go and apply. And when I went to apply, you remember Carol Francis? Absolutely. So I went and applied with her and she, she said, Well, I'm gonna send you on a job. And I want to see how you do. So I said, Okay, that's good. I was so nervous. I promise. I was shaking like crazy. And, you know, after I did the job, she said, Oh, yeah, okay, you're good. You got this. Here's your paperwork. I'll see you next week. And I was just thrilled I caught my mama crying and I was just so very happy. But that was like really my first you know, and Carol, got my foot in the door with actually interpreting. My time back in Michigan. When I was going to Mott. I was managing an interpreting agency. So I wasn't going out and doing the work but I was in the office and dispatching the interpreters and things like that. So, you know, I was kind of looking at it from both sides. I had the office experience and I was getting out and yeah, absolutely loved it.
Tina:So what do you suggest for somebody who's just about to graduate? Like, first of all, unfortunately, we got to bring COVID up. Majority of the students are about to graduate or COVID learning students. In other words, they've been at home, this whole interaction that we keep telling them to do is hard, but not still necessary. So, yeah. Is there any good advice that you have for them? Like, listen, we know you're struggling, but here's what you should be doing?
Lily:Yes, definitely. So for the new graduates, I would say, first of all, never stop learning. And that is something that I don't feel I did enough of. So I'm very vocal about that. When I talk to interpreters, every workshop or initiative or online Zoom where they're talking about something that you may be slightly interested in, sign up for it, get that certificate, get those CEUs do all of the things because exposure is really where our meat and potatoes are, we're live as an interpreter, we need to be exposed to things we can learn like interpreters are, we know a bit about a whole lot. And so we need to have that exposure into a lot of different areas. And so I always encourage your graduates to dip your hand into every workshop that you see. Also be very social in the deaf community. That's another regret that I have something I wish I would have done more be vocal show up to Deaf night out now that they're, I think reinstated? I think so yeah. But show up and be seen. And, you know, because it's one thing to learn in the classroom, but your skills become razor sharp, when you are actually social and around your deaf community and exposing yourself to the people that you will be working for, in essence, it's good for them to see you as in not just the doctor's office or the courtroom, but it's good for them to see you sitting across the table sharing a meal as well. So, um, those are the two things that I am, you know, I feel that it's very important for new graduates to do get the exposure This, of course, you know, with COVID, it is hard, you know, there are restrictions that are varying in each area. But even if your exposure comes off Zoom, do not ever shun an opportunity to get that exposure.
Tina:And that's what every interview I have said, that's the thing. Get yourself out there. And my next and last question you've already answered, what things would you have done differently? And it sounds like you're saying, I wish I would have I don't want to use the word expose, but I wish I was out there in the field more. So yeah, you just what, why? Why didn't you?
Lily:You know, because I was intimidated. And that's the short answer.
Tina:I don't see that at all right, you can tell me that ,but
Lily:You know, I put on a good face. But honestly, those micro wow.
Tina:I've never noticed that. aggressions and things that were said to me, it affected me. Sure. And I never felt that I was as good of an interpreter as I was. And my confidence level, decreasing with certain interactions caused me to retreat in certain ways that I wish I had pushed against. And so you know, when I meet a new interpreter, particularly a black interpreter, you know, I always want to make sure that they know you have a community behind supporting you, because we can't afford for your confidence to wane. And then for you to feel that you are not needed. You are needed, you're required. You are seeing and you're valued. And I believe that now on the other side of, you know, racial uprising that we've experienced here in the country recently, and all of the other things the dumpster fire that the year 2020 was. I think that now we've recognize that those are things that need to be said to people you're valuee you're seen you are required here we want to here and the only person who was telling me that was Royce. And I it was so hard for me to trust it. And honestly she was you know, was was attending workshops and thing was she would be the only brown face there. And she would invite me to come along and I said no, no. And you know, that is something that if I had it to do over again and I would have been on and on with her, and even when she couldn't go I would have been going because that right there, you know, to take up space, unapologetically is what we need to hear with what we need to know, to go to those workshops, to go to those meetings and let people think whatever they want to think. If they look at you like, oh, well, you know, we're not sure how skilled you are. That is not your business. I paid for the workshop the same way that you did, I am occupying this seat on this day. (PREACH)I am ready. So I really feel you know, there are so many times, so many times, and it's heartbreaking. I will see new interpreters and they and black interpreters, and they're very timid. And I just want to be that voice to, you know, because you know, I talk Tina, you know how I can go.
Lily:My momma used to say, girl, if you would just get right up a wonderful evangelist, I can start. Right, but I just won't do right. But, you know, just really, I consider it an honor. Now on this side of it. I've learned that lesson for a reason. And at the end of the day, when I see those timid interpreters, it's my job to tell them, girl, pick it up. You got this you belong here, stand in that space. Finally, unapologetically.
Tina:Exactly. And you know Royce and I talk about the swan. And that swan on the outside, while it glides across the water looks flawless, smooth, nothing. Nothing bothers me. But underneath that water, your feet are just paddling. Yeah, to get you going like that. And that's what we are as interpreters. And I believe it sounds like you're saying it's even more so for an interpreter of color, a black interpreter, because they have other things that they're dealing with in that moment that makes them look like you know what, yeah, I may be the only black person in the room, but I am THE black person in the back. And so and and I'm sure that just takes so much energy for you to do that. And I so appreciate what you have brought here today to to this podcast, and this information. And I just hope that those who are listening, take this to heart and say, Listen, we have to have discussions. We have to have discussions. And we are a team of interpreters. We can't work against each other. Because, you know, it's already a tough enough job. I went to a workshop, I didn't really go it was a Zoom. I'll just call and I did a workshop not in a couple of months ago. I keep saying a couple of months ago. It's probably now a year. But I went and the one thing that this presenter said that was so profound, and I was like, Oh my gosh, I've never thought of it like this. She said our job is very hard. And I thought she's right. Yeah. This job is very hard. Yeah. So yeah. But for those of us who are very good at it, make it look very easy. Yes. Even though we still struggle with how hard and I've been doing this for over 40 years. And there's there's always a day where I say that was very hard. Yeah, I don't care how long I've been doing it. I don't care how much I understand. I don't understand. That was very hard. But I got through it. Yeah,
Lily:Exactly. Yeah, definitely. I feel the exact same way. Like there's some days where it's just, it feels like a weight is on you. Like there have been times left jobs and I'm like, Oh, I bombed. You know, and, but at the end of the day, we have to go to give ourselves the grace that we give to other people you know, we're so hard on ourselves. Yeah, and interpreters are ever learning. There's never a time when we have reached the top and we're done. We are ever learning. And we are ever evolving. And, you know, we have to give ourselves the grace to be students to be forever students, but to also be excellent. and own it.
Tina:Exactly. Because we owe that to the consumers we work with, and to ourselves and to ourselves, you know, yeah. And so I know just like you say, I've left assignments or whatever and like I suck, I suck and you know, and Royce and I both say the same thing. You know, our students think oh, we never make mistakes and it's and we have to allow our students to see our mistakes. Yeah, because if we try to go in there saying it one day you will be able to do this perfectly is false and from it's disinformation.
Lily:Exactly is the same way that I feel about parenting. You know, I'm a mother of two girls. And I early on had to learn to tell myself, my girls don't need a perfect mother that they need a whole one. And sometimes I'm a whole mess, and that's fine. But you know, we think about interpreting outcome so much don't need perfect interpret. They need whole ones. Yes, they need to see that we are invested in understanding their message so that we can get it to them wholly. Yes, perfectly. But wholly. Because we you know, we're not perfectly right. And yeah,
Tina:yeah. Gosh, Lily, it's been awesome having you here today. All this information has been so valuable to me. And to our listening audience, is there anything you would like to say before I close?
Lily:You know, I just want to say thank you for this opportunity. I never turn down a chance to talk because it's the best thing I do. But I
Tina:I'll give you an amen on that.
Lily:Give me a microphone, I can go for days. But I just truly appreciate this opportunity. This has been wonderful. And thank you, Tina, for this platform.
Tina:This is amazing. You know, and I am so open. I love doing this for a and I love us just being able to have dialogue and sharing information. If you think hey, this person would be great. You just send them our way. Because I will give anybody the platform that would like to come on here and share with us we so I so welcome that. Absolutely, definitely. So thank you so so much. And you've come to my listening audience and to the reading audience. I thank you for coming and listening. And I am sure that from what Lily has said today that you have learned something, I think it's time that we all take a look at us on the inside. Because what's on the inside comes on the outside. We want We're a team. We're a team of people that work together who so happened to be different colors, different backgrounds, and all of us bring something to the table. And it's never a good situation when one of them thinks they're going to do better than the other because this is a hand in hand. We just work hand in hand together. So I want to thank everybody for listening and I will post any information that you need to know that goes along with this. But we thank Lily so much and I thank you my audience for listening to us today. Thank you so much.
Lily:Thank you