Hello, and welcome to Tina's Corner podcast. Now we are a group of like minded sign language interpreters set out to improve the field of sign language interpreters. We are actually a triad of people. We have deaf consumers, hearing consumers, and both hearing and deaf interpreters that complete this triad. And the focus of this podcast is to strengthen that triad. Now all persons who are listening regardless of years of experience and how you got to be an interpreter will benefit. I am Tina Perry, and I welcome you. Now today I've invited Christine Mitchell to share her insights and experiences so that others can see that interpreters traveled different roads. But we all get to the same place, set out to improve the sign language interpreting, and to show equality of information for all consumers. Now today, we welcome Christine Mitchell. And I want to first of all let you know how I know her. Now Christine was my boss. She actually we both work for company of sorts and Video Relay Services. And I currently work there I don't believe Christine is there any longer and she could let us know about that. But at any rate, she was the manager when I was there, in Columbus, Ohio. Now Christine is certified. She has her NIC master and also the state QA level for Illinois. She has a level five. Christine is the lead interpreter in the department of Deaf Studies at California State University Northridge. Now, she, she says, you know, she's got some accomplishments, but I tell you, I think one of the complements is that she is a sign language interpreter. I think that's an awesome accomplishment. But she does have a passion for mentoring, diagnostics and workshop development. And that is so important to the field of interpreting. So would you please help me welcome, Christine. Hi, Christine.
Christine:Well, hello, Tina, how are you?
Tina:Well, we are now just recovering from that big old "C" word COVID. And actually, we're doing quite nicely. But yeah, just got through the hot was hoping to get through the holidays without it. But I guess, I guess not. But actually, we're doing quite nicely. So thanks for asking.
Christine:Thanks for having me. Today. I hear it's pretty much unavoidable, and it just got into my house. So I'm in the same boat with you. Yep.
Tina:I think that's what they're saying everybody's going to get a touch of it some way or another. But at any rate, we're not going to focus on that, because we're tired of talking about that. So I have some questions for you, Christine. And I want you to help us understand how you got to where you are today. So first of all, can you tell me and I want everybody to remember, we all have a different journey? And Christine, will you kind of start out with your journey about how you you know, as far as your education, or how is it that you first got into the field of interpreting?
Christine:Well, I am not a trained interpreter. If you think about it as taking the formal route of going through an IEP an IPP or an ITP. My education is actually a K 12, Deaf Ed with a minor in Spanish that I cannot use, I do not speak Spanish enough to get myself to the store right now. And then I have a master's in education as well. But I got into interpreting because in my middle school, they had an DHH program. And so I sort of fell into it by default. I started interpreting the minute I started learning to sign. And so I used the word interpreting very loosely. It was more of the interpreters not here can you fake yourself, the students in class what's going on, because they didn't have logs back then. And so I just, I just ended up really falling in love with the language. And I made some good friends and I got interpreted, I got better at interpreting, because I sort of didn't have a choice. In order for all of us to hang out, I had to be able to tell people what was going on and what my friends were saying. And I ended up pursuing it from there.
Tina:You know, that is, as many people may think, oh, my gosh, that's not common. That's very common. That is very common for a lot of us who started out in the field of interpreting, including myself. Now, of course, my road looks a little different. But you're right. That is that's a very common way of getting into the field interpreting, although I do hear you say you are educated, but not necessarily in the field of interpreting, am I correct?
Christine:That is correct. I spent a long time learning as much as I could and feeling a little loss about all of the fancy words in terms. And so for the last probably 10 or 15 years, I've just read as many articles I can as I could and bothered as many interpreting teachers as I could and continues to just take professional development. And I found it's been very helpful to put words to understand what I'm doing. So I do still encourage it, even if you have the opportunity to be immersed in the language and to have wonderful mentors, but for me, it's sort of all the pieces of the puzzle are helpful. So I went after all the pieces of the puzzle.
Tina:That's awesome. Tell me how many years from beginning to current? Are we looking at here? of your iin the field
Christine:I started unofficially interpreting when I was 10. So without giving away my age, I'm looking at three and a half decades. I just gave away my age. But but with pay, I was thinking I was eighteen. So I'm looking I'm very close to the 30 year mark, I think I'm at 27 years or something like
Tina:So what you're saying is, it doesn't matter how long you're in the field, education is very important?
Christine:Yes, and I'm actually growing, I found out some spoken language interpreters do have a lot to say about interpreting that hasn't hit our field yet. And also they - that's reciprocal by the way. Spoken Language Interpreters are often learning from sign language interpreters. Um, so I'm finding that piece of our field fascinating right now.
Tina:So you talked about doing workshops? And did you ever have a mentor? Or do you consider somebody to have be a mentor? Or have you ever pursued that route?
Christine:I don't know if people would consider themselves to have been my mentor. But I certainly had people that I considered role models and that I used as if they were my mentor. When I first started interpreting for pay, I was in central South Central Illinois, and Missy Walkingstick, took me under her wing. She was a certified interpreter at the time. And then there was a coda interpreter who I believe has recently passed, who took me under her wing. And those two taught me sort of how the field worked, and what steps I needed to do to be a professional. Everything from you can't wear lime green pants, to this is how you bill. And yes, I needed to learn those lessons, because I never, I just grew up around people, I didn't know that I had to go look a certain way. So I did and then, and then I had a mentor who helped me with my people skills and was an immense impact on me. And that was Stephanie Criner, who I believe you also are familiar with,
Tina:I do seem to know her, Yes. She's the best. She's the best. And I think, you know, those soft skills are things that we just don't really, I'm gonna, I'm just gonna put this out there as a coda me too. You know, I started out kind of like the same way, hey, we need an interpreter, you can sign come on in. And that was very typical, then all of a sudden, is there is this professional side to this, that some of us just don't really know how to handle that. And so I think education partner, having good mentors, somebody that's willing to be very honest with you and just say, Hey, this is this is not how we do it. And I think those things are important. Now you do have deaf family. Am I correct?
Christine:Okay, so, people define deaf family differently. So I'm just going to take one quick second to say I have an aunt with a hearing loss, and a congenital hole in her heart that she does not sign. So for the purposes of me, having grown up and been born with the language, no, so it's not generational family. My husband is deaf. And I have a deaf dog now. So I have married into married into a relationship with a deaf person. So if you define that as having deaf family, then yes, but having grown up with deaf people in my family, no.
Tina:I see, you do have a deaf dog. Does your dog does he know or she know commands in ASL?
Christine:Yes, she does. We use the combination of ASL commands and we use a combination of one handed gestures that were easier to treat and sign to her sometimes like the sign for sit she was a really energetic baby. So we use a gesture percent that only requires one hand instead of the traditional sign for'sit' as an example, but she's very, very, very bright because of her breed. And she has, it's been lovely having her in the house because I felt like we were a good home for her. She responded very well to the visual cues to sitting by us into following us around the house. So she's pretty happy to be in a house full of signers.
Tina:Tell me about your first, what you would consider your first professional interpreting position.
Christine:I can tell you right now, my first professional interpreting position was in Jacksonville, Illinois at the MacMurry College. That was my college they had a K 12 Deaf program or deaf education program. We had a couple of Deaf students in the school with us who were also majoring in deaf education, and the school for deaf was a mile down the street. So we had a really nice deaf community in town. But because it was a rural area with only 20,000 people total in the population, most of the interpreters were in Springfield about a half hour away. So my friend and I, and you might know him, Jonathan Bordean. He's also from Columbus, his mom is a well known interpreter, Sharon Bordean When we were at MacMurry, my first year, I was told of a need to interpret not only the college, but at the Jacksonville Community Center for the Deaf in at the Illinois School to deaf.. So those three were my first jobs. And I would call them all freelance jobs, where I carried an old pager and I had to learn the code for if it was an emergency, or if I decided to call them back(laughter). So I sort of jumped in professionally, way before I knew what I was getting myself into.
Tina:Wow, you know, today, with our students, and I say our students, because I believe both of you, both you and I are still considered to be educators, our students are really struggling, first of all, because of COVID, that did not help the situation at all. But just now being they're doing online learning, they're doing some in person learning, but the missing component is just knowing how to get into the field of interpreting. Now, I know you told me about your first interpreting positions. And I know with the current position that you hold, how are you advising students like to find out about certain positions that are available to them?
Christine:You know, I actually think that students in interpreter training programs at this point are more fortunate than those coming in with no networking. Unless you have a family member who can tell you about a local interpreting agency, it's very hard to get in right now. Because there's a there are many places that require certification and or licensure. And also because of COVID, there's, there's really a distrust of a student coming out of a program where they haven't had any real world experience. So our students have been relying heavily on their teachers and mentors to introduce them to write letters of reference and to give them some, some nice some unpaid internships if necessary, where they can get their resume moving. And a lot of those unpaid internships depend on who the mentor was, because again, it goes back to that networking who can provide you the reference. So we've been hosting practices or previous sessions, we've been doing mentor training, talking to the teachers and having some of our Deaf deaf faculty and staff on campus have mock online conversations with us so that they can practice interpreting over Zoom with something that's more than a recorded videotape. And then we're carefully calling residencies, apprenticeships, extended internship, post graduation and getting some of them there, because those are great steps to get them in the door. So Sherette Estes, has a wonderful internship in Washington DC with AI and then and you know Sherette from from Columbus, Ohio, and then and then I often will send people to Rochester Instiutue Technology, NTID has a great apprenticeship. And then people will send them to many other places to Catie center, etc. So the higher performing students, I will try to get them into some agencies and apprenticeships, and the students who need a little bit longer. We're trying to pull them into extended internships in the fall semester when we don't take practicum students yet.
Tina:And what about the students who have already graduated? Are there things that they can become involved in on their own? Let's just say they're, you know, they're currently in a program, but they're seeking to improve upon their skills or they're looking for a mentorship program? Where would you suggest that they go to look to be able to get that information?
Christine:One of the one of the keys to establishing a network within the Deaf community is being able to volunteer with agencies that are rooted in the deaf community so they're 'by, for and of'. So let's say someone was living in their hometown, they would find out if their state or their local area had and National Black Deaf advocates chapter. If they had a rainbow Association of the Deaf chapter. If they had a local NAD chapter. We have a teacher association chapter an ASLTA chapter, theatre, what have you and start volunteering. It may have nothing to do with interpreting they might just be an usher for a production at a play, or they could go in and, you know, sit outside with the nurse who's doing whatever, and sees deaf patients, or they could volunteer to be, you know, lots of places like our local RID chapter is desperately in need of people to take over the positions because we get burned out so fast. There are so many of us, there are so few of us doing multiple jobs, that we welcome interns of any sort, any volunteering, and those are really great ways to form relationships with people who have a broad network, and can get you into a job. Because if you meet somebody, at Cal Ed the Education Association, they're going to be able to tell you which schools are supportive schools, if somebody is ready for that, or it or which local agency is going to provide a mentor for you, and they might even be able to put in a call for you. So for me, it's getting to know people and I feel most comfortable getting to know people when I have a role, which is why I recommend volunteering so much. And I know we want to get paid, but sometimes there'll be a teacher's aide first, and get to know those people and work on your language. And then the agency will realize that you're actually working in the field and might be more willing to hire you for community work, or vice versa.
Tina:So in other words, have your face in every place. And you know, you're right, we do want to get paid. Of course, we've spent all this money going to school, but volunteering does pay off. And I think my most the most successful students that I had seen were the ones that were just wherever there was a deaf person, they were there. And was it comfortable for them? No. But eventually, it became very comfortable to the point. And when the deaf when a deaf person sees you over and over, they think, Okay, this is a serious person. This is a person who really wants to do this job. And I think just having your face, every place is very important.
Christine:So I couldn't agree more. Tina, I couldn't agree more.
Tina:So are you You are currently certified, obviously. And again, can you tell me your certifications?
Christine:So the certification, I think that's the most relevant right now is I hold the RID certification. And that was at the time when they're providing levels and NIC, Advanced and Master. And so I have a Master, but that's that's only relevant if you took the test during a certain period of time when they're providing levels, it really speaks more to the interview than the performance test. So I just want to recognize, when I see an NIC come across my desk, I don't care about the level I just look for are you certified?
Tina:Very good. How did you prepare for that certification test?
Christine:For Okay, so I a little bit have a cheat, because I have, I have a teaching background, and I know how tests are written. But my preparation was really more about getting comfortable with being in front of a camera. So working in the VRS field, for me was important people coming out of an IEP would also have that experience of working in 2d and being able to test. I asked around to people who either were on the testing committee at that time, or had taken a previous already test, what are the things that a tester is looking for? So if I make a mistake, what do they want me to do? Do they want me to tell them I made a mistake? Do they want me to fix it? Do they want me to do some combinations that I just skip over it and move on? What can I do to just keep going and rebound rebound from those? And then I was looking at I looked online and I checked for? How are they grading? What is the person on the rubric looking for so that I can verify that I have those skills? Because there's no real way to cheat? When you take a test? It's more about do you have test anxiety? And have you worked around that? Did you have a good day? Are you well slept, fed, etc? And then do you have the foundational skills regardless, to get you through the test? Because if you have the foundational skills, those other two things can mess you up. But if you don't have the foundational skills, then of course you would need to keep practicing. So I studied, I looked at the rubric. And then I started practicing how I was going to answer those tests. But I didn't spend too many times doing actual practice run throughs of a test. Just because I wanted to feel fresh, like I was walking into a new interpreting assignment.
Tina:Very good. And, you know, we know how stressful that test can be or any anything that is measuring your skills are what it was very stressful. How did you, were you able to keep your stress under control? How did you handle the stress level of that?
Christine:You know, when I took my state tests, because I also had to state QA. I took that first and I was in college still because you know I started interpreting my freshman year of college professionally. And so when they when they started mandating a state test I drove up to Chicago so that the three and a half hour trip, my friend, and I did. And then we got lunch and we calmed ourselves down, we talked ourselves through it. So the first tip is bring a buddy. And then we both took the test. And then we went out to eat, and I cried all the way home, because I let my stress out after the test was done. So that's what I did the first time around. The second time around, I drank, I drank, I think I drank Sleepytime tea extra with valerian root, I took like, you know, (?) chamomile whatever it is needed to calm down. I did that I walked around, I practice deep breathing, which sounds really silly and never worked for me. But I do it anyway, before the test just so I can get my breathing under control. And then afterwards, I think I was a little nervous. But I told myself a lie. I told myself, I didn't care when I was done. So I lied to myself until I got my results.
Tina:And a lot of people do that just to be able to mask the fact that you know, what, if I don't pass, I didn't really care whether or not I did. And there's no way you can say we don't care. But I think it's just a good way of trying to convince your brain like, it's alright, and you know what? it is alright! If you are somebody who takes the test, and you do not pass the first time, it is okay. That's something you learn from, look, try to figure out what will I do differently for the next test and even go in being more prepared? Would you agree with that?
Christine:I would, because I know some fantastic interpreters who didn't score the way they thought they were gonna score, and took it again until they got the score that they wanted.. Now it's a hefty price take to repeat that. But they knew they have the ability, and I knew they had the ability. So for them, it was a good investment, it was more about mastering test anxiety, or figuring out what they were doing that wasn't cueuing in the test takers to the to the certain competencies that they were looking for.
Tina:Exactly. Exactly. Christine, you have given us so much great information. But I'm going to ask you one question here, as while you're while you have been on your journey, and I know you still are. But let's take a look back, can you tell me one thing you wish and there may be more than one, that's okay. But one thing you wish you would have done differently while on this journey?
Christine:(inaudible). Now a number of things I would have done differently. But like you said, I think that we all could say that about ourselves. We were constantly thinking that hindsight is 20/20. And so for me, I think balance would have been the word I would told my younger self, because I'm an all or nothing kind of a person. And I dove into interpreting, not knowing anything about interpreting, and that was great. I'm glad that I found some mentors, or should I say they found me, the balance would have been to be a little bit more intentional and to take myself a little bit less seriously. Because it it took me a number of years to understand that the process of feedback, how that happens from the deaf community, how that happens from interpreter peers, and to be able to sort through and incorporate what was useful without having my self esteem blown to bits. So balance would have been the key thing I would have told myself to remember that, that you need a little bit of everything. And you're going to get there. As long as you keep yourself sort of, you know, don't be too extreme one way or the other.
Tina:That's awesome advice. Christina, I cannot tell you(Christina)
Christine:Can I tell myself one more thing?
Tina:sure
Christine:Okay, this is something that I used to think. And I hear this regularly from interpreters coming into the field, which is like the end goal in life is to either be mistaken as a CODA or to be mistaken as a deaf person. And I think that's a horrible goal. In retrospect, because there's no one size, all perfect fit interpreter, every interpreter is going to be a good fit for a different set of deaf people. And recognizing that my skill set might be great for certain people, but might not be great for other people allows me to let go of that obscene benchmark, that if you hit it, you become arrogant. And if you don't hit that, then you're your soul is crushed for you know, infinity. And so that's something I also would have told myself, it's really not about achieving a certain level certification or being recognized by certain people. None of that matters. What matters is that I keep growing, and that I that I find people that that benefit from working with me, and that I benefit from working with them and that we maintain those relationships and grow them.
Tina:That's awesome, because, you know, what if we all had that motto, boy, I mean, just working together and when we work as a team together, that's what teamwork is about. Hey, I have this strength, you have that strength, and together, kind of like when I talked about in the beginning the triad together, we will be stronger. And I think that was excellent advice! Christine thank you very, very much. Boy, this was awesome. And I think the advice that you have given us and talked about your journey has been nothing less than wonderful. And I know that those listeners both experienced and not so experienced will definitely learn and benefit from having you with us today. Again, I thank you so much. And I hope that you and I will do some future work together.
Christine:I look forward to that. That's fantastic, thank you. I'd be honored.
Tina:Thank you to our listening audience. I hope you enjoy today. Have a great day. Bye now.